In conversation with John Lees

What was your journey into career coaching?

I started my career in learning and development, then was appointed to a role leading the main industry body for training recruitment consultants.

After moving into employment research, I decided it was time to do something different.

Thinking about my own career change I became interested in how people change careers, and wondered what would happen if I tried to apply the kind of creative thinking used in businesses to individual career choice and change.

I had the idea for my first book, How to Get a Job You Love.

I enjoyed road-testing exercises and ideas with career clients, so after training interviewers for many years I found I was much more interested in people sitting on the other side of the desk.

 

What experiences shaped the way you work as a coach?

First, my background working in the recruitment industry gave me a real sense of the gritty reality of recruitment processes, and the way that hiring decisions are often more subjective and arbitrary than people think.

One of the areas where I know I am most useful is helping clients decode employer and recruiter mindset and behaviours - increasing the chances of getting short listed or securing a job offer.

A formative period for me was working in outplacement in the North West of the UK, working with a wide range of clients from middle level managers to NHS Chief Executives.

Working with smart, challenging clients with the deadlines and structures imposed by commercial programmes has always impressed on me that what career coaches are often required to do is to shorten an individual’s job search time and keep their confidence up in the process.

While there are many other things we do, these two are still high on my list.

I was hugely influenced by some very different work in 2000, where I helped set up and run a job coaching scheme for young people in a Johannesburg township.

Providing encouragement and resources where unemployment levels for young people was sky high was a humbling experience.

It also made me think very differently about wants and needs in the developed world.

I suppose I am also shaped by the fact I have worked for myself or undertaken consultancy work for around three decades.

This is helpful where I am working with people who want to set up their own business or do something else which isn’t a conventional job.

 

Providing encouragement and resources where unemployment levels for young people was sky high was a humbling experience.

 

Who has inspired you?

I had the privilege of knowing Richard Nelson Bolles, author of What Color is Your Parachute?

I attended his two-week workshop in Oregon on two separate occasions, and met him many times afterwards.

Dick was an inspiration to a whole generation of career coaches and kindly wrote the preface to one of my books.

We had many things in common, including being ordained ministers in the Anglican church.

 

What does your work currently involve?

My work involves a great deal of writing (thinking up new titles and rewriting old ones) - especially when a deadline is looming.

At those times I become rather difficult to live with – it takes a kind of manic focus to keep a whole book in your head and avoid the risk of missing something vital out, or repeating material.

It’s a great challenge though, and enjoyable seeing books being published.

At other times I am writing articles, producing resources, or responding to journalist questions.

Outside lockdown I enjoy opportunities to talk about career change and job hunting, often with job hunters, career changers, business school students and alumni.

The rest of my time is spent coaching one to one, or passing work along to my very skilled colleagues.

I also enjoy opportunities to train career coaches and speaking at a wide range of venues and institutions.

I have regular commitments but also enjoy the surprise element of things that arrive in my inbox.

 

It takes a kind of manic focus to keep a whole book in your head and avoid the risk of missing something vital out, or repeating material.

 

How would you describe the philosophy of your career coaching?

I realised after several years of training coaches that the most important thing we do as career coaches might be about enabling people to think differently.

Clients come for information and advice, but since information and advice are freely available, what they often really need is help thinking through their deepest questions, and learning to look at the experienced world differently.

For example, seeing the way people create junk statistical results based on a small number of applications, or the way we all make decisions too early and forget that a key part of the process is open-minded exploration.

Career coaching is often person-centred but also involves passing on tips, recommending strategies, and pointing to short cuts.

This range of styles worries some coaches, but for me the balance is straightforward – our job is to move the client forward rather than leaving them stuck in the question, and if a tip or technique shortens the process, that’s great.

 

What drives you in your work?

Feedback, being a vain soul, is fairly important to me - few of us would be in this work if we didn’t want evidence that we can sometimes make a difference.

I particularly enjoy my role as an encourager – reminding clients of the things they have almost forgotten they can do.

Finally, I really enjoy refreshing material, or inventing and adapting career exercises and other tools.

 

I particularly enjoy my role as an encourager – reminding clients of the things they have almost forgotten they can do.

 

Why did you decide to join the Firework team?

The team are a great bunch of people with a philosophy and values I find appealing.

To me, the Firework coaching model is honest and effective, charting the key stages clients go through, and barriers they place in the way of progress.

What might look like a minor setback one day can easily become a powerful narrative preventing not only change, but any kind of exploration.

I admire the way the Firework model brings out the best in clients and provides a rich range of tools and resources to assist on their journey, and I’m also impressed by the way the material has grown and developed over the years.

 

What are some of the most common challenges you see career coaches facing when working with their clients – and what are the best ways for coaches to overcome these problems?

There are a lot of challenges!

The first is working with clients who know they really want to make a change but don’t know where to point themselves.

That requires a good toolkit of exercises and conversations.

The second is confidence.

Almost anything can knock this for clients – initial disappointment, someone not returning their call, any kind of negative response – but the result is the same – a slow-down in activity and commitment, and sometimes a dead stop.

‘Stuck’ clients are such a common feature of the process and need careful strategies.

 

When does the breakthrough moment happen when you’re training career coaches?

This happens when coaches learn to trust their own resources rather than relying on processes – when you don’t always feel you have to use your kitbag of exercises, but you can rely on great questions.

The second breakthrough is when you realise you don’t need to have encyclopaedic knowledge of jobs and careers, just the ability to show people how to look.

 

You don’t need to have encyclopaedic knowledge of jobs and careers, just the ability to show people how to look.

 

What are the wider trends you’re seeing in the employment market and career transitions – and how do you expect these to develop over the coming years?

The most important trend before the 2020 lockdown was what I call jobs ‘going underground’ – the disappearance of most conventionally advertised jobs.

We're all conditioned by the late 20th Century job market, where vacancies were clearly identifiable and application processes predictable.

In the last 20 years organisations have learned to fill roles efficiently with minimal cost, through social media, organisation web pages, and through word of mouth.

This last method is the most perplexing for job hunters because instead of just needing good CV writing and organisation skills, now everyone needs to develop high level social skills to connect, influence and gain recommendations.

Career coaches in my view need to be particularly adept at coaching their clients in soft networking skills and authentic communication.

Another important trend is the way responsibility for careers is shifting away from organisations and onto individuals.

Organisations change so quickly and so often they really are struggling to deliver on long-term career promises.

Rather than jobs with a long-term future, a lot of work is going to be project-by-project, which means that individuals will get far less organisational support.

Self-reliance and resilience are becoming increasingly vital, which can feel like a shock to some clients who still hope that an employer will offer long-term security.

Finally, work just keeps getting more diverse, in every sense of the word.

New types of jobs are being created every week, and we have no idea yet what the great home working experiment of 2020 is going to mean in terms of future working patterns.

Just as our clients need curiosity to drive their exploration, coaches need to keep monitoring the fast-changing world of work.

 

Instead of just needing good CV writing and organisation skills, now everyone needs to develop high level social skills to connect, influence and gain recommendations.

 

What surprises you still?

After writing 15 books I do of course see ideas coming round more than once, but it’s great to see genuinely new thinking emerging all the time about work and careers.

One feature of a 40-year career is that you’ve heard most questions but you’re still thinking about the best answers.

What surprises me most is where I hear out of the blue from people I’ve helped with my books and materials.

Sometimes years after they read something that prompted a big change in their lives.

I love it when they get in touch to tell me what I wrote or said which made the difference.

 

John Lees is a career strategist and author, and now part of the training faculty for the Firework Coaching Programme. He's published 15 books on careers and work including the UK best-seller ‘How to Get a Job You Love’ and his latest, ‘Get Ahead in Your New Job’. John was previously Chief Executive of the Institute of Employment Consultants and a founding board member of the Career Development Institute. He holds degrees from the Universities of Cambridge, London and Liverpool and is a NICEC Fellow. Find out more at www.johnleescareers.com.